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Tuesday Night Open Thread

By Jeralyn, Section Blog Related
Posted on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 09:36:50 PM EST
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New Jersey's Governor Chris Christie today said he will allow the medical marijuana bill passed under his predecessor to be implemented. Doctors will be allowed to prescribe marijuana in New Jersey (but patients can't grow it.)

Only patients in New Jersey suffering from specific ailments such as HIV, cancer and multiple sclerosis can be prescribed medical marijuana, and then only after other treatments have failed. The law also is the first in the nation to prohibit patients from growing their own crop at home.

New Jersey is now the 16th state to allow medical marijuana (the District of Columbia does as well.)

It's too hot to blog any more tonight, and our earlier open thread is almost full, so here's another one, all topics welcome.

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    Sorry for the lack of tweets (5.00 / 3) (#2)
    by jeffinalabama on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:09:04 PM EST
    after a certain time...

    Last Tweet, or collection of tweets:

    Bend over, you're going to feel some pressure.

    You're going to feel some pressure again.

    Jefinalabama@doctor: If I feel one more pressure, there's going to be a MISUNDERSTANDING including FURNITURE MOVING in this room!

    Cancer, folks, gotta have a biopsy to see how far it's gone, and gotta write like a maniac.  I'll make it. My Ranger Tab is a magic cure.

    Damm doctor said lose 40 lbs ASAP (5.00 / 2) (#3)
    by jeffinalabama on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:13:10 PM EST
    before surgery if possible. No carbs. That's like no bread... and NO BEER! I told him I'd start tomorrow.

    No Beer for an infantryman/cavalryman? I thought doctors were supposed to be bright.

    Parent

    before the surgery? (5.00 / 3) (#5)
    by desmoinesdem on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:20:21 PM EST
    Wouldn't it take months to lose 40 pounds? I hope that not rushing you into surgery ASAP means they aren't too concerned about how far things have spread.

    Good luck with your treatment--sending healing thoughts your way.

    Parent

    Too fat for where the robots (none / 0) (#17)
    by jeffinalabama on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:59:26 PM EST
    need to cut and enter. I told y'all I was fat...

    Parent
    Hmm... (5.00 / 1) (#6)
    by StephenAG on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:22:07 PM EST
    Jeff, ask your oncologist if brachytherapy is a surgery option for whatever you are dealing with. Not being nosy; just askin' (it has worked very well for my "situation").

    Parent
    Asked and answered-- (none / 0) (#38)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:21:27 AM EST
    he could feel nodes. As he said, he's 99 percent certain. He HOPES my biopsies are clear and its benign. But, given the numbers, family history, and rapid climb, removal by robotics is the best option.

    Guess I ought to start trimming, to get used to wearing the prorn guy cut, lol!

    Parent

    Some Lester Young... (none / 0) (#54)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:46:47 AM EST
    known as Smooth on the Tenor sax... I do love jazz.

    Parent
    Bilie Holiday, with (5.00 / 1) (#55)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 02:04:59 AM EST
    Ben Webster and Lester Young on the tenor Saxes, I think Roy Eldridge on trumpet (Few did those licks), don't know the guy on the baritone sax.

    Music as it was meant to be played. Slow and soulful.

    Oh, yeah

    Parent

    anyone who likes Ben Webster (5.00 / 1) (#111)
    by jondee on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 02:05:36 PM EST
    and Lester Young should stick around for a hundred more years, in my book.

    Really, good luck and Godspeed, Jeff. And find a way to keep laughing..Consider the armadillo and the duck-billed palatypus, they neither toil nor do they spin..

    Parent

    She curls and luxuriates (5.00 / 1) (#115)
    by jondee on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 03:00:12 PM EST
    around a lyric the way a cat rubs on a table leg..

    Love that woman.

    And Ben Webster reinvents the blues every time he plays 'em.

    That baritone looks like Gerry Mulligan, btw..

    Parent

    Jazz is the great... (none / 0) (#136)
    by desertswine on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 09:53:03 PM EST
    American gift to the world. The first 20 lbs are the hardest, you're going to do great!

    Parent
    Very sorry to hear :( (5.00 / 2) (#8)
    by nycstray on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:31:38 PM EST
    WL tip: remove processed food from diet. Also, look up 'super foods'. Many are in season now.

    Best of the best to you. Ya gotta kick some C-b*tt so you can lead us to our ARRRRGH! destination :)

    Parent

    definitely. (none / 0) (#18)
    by jeffinalabama on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:00:35 PM EST
    No more... a lot of things. Fresh, even uncooked.

    Sounds like SERE training taken to a new level, lol!

    Parent

    Jeff, my own experience (5.00 / 3) (#88)
    by brodie on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 09:42:49 AM EST
    from yrs ago in this weight loss/cancer area is to switch quickly to real/unprocessed foods approximating a mostly vegetarian or Jesus diet (occasional baked fish/chicken ok).  Daily lunch of leafy greens + raw veggies, topped by olive oil-based dressing, is vital.  

    I found the Concord grape juice approach the most effective in changing my dietary habits (probably w/n a 3-week period) and in helping reduce weight.  2-3 oz of Concord grape juice diluted by 1-2 oz of water taken 1/2 hr before each major meal, then the last thing before retiring (or 4x/daily).  Soon you will not be craving the wrong starchy and sweet things, as the grape juice provides just the right type of sugars the body can assimilate easily and efficiently.

    Plenty of daily water.  Red, not white, wine, but only 2-3 oz daily.

    Daily 1 hr exercise that works up a sweat, but needn't be more than a brisk walk, crucial.

    Good luck.

    Parent

    Thanks for the advice, (5.00 / 2) (#124)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:16:52 PM EST
    I'll try the grape juice starting tonight. Went shopping for fresh fruits and veggies today, hit the farmer's market tomorrow.

    MAking a big pot of soup--beans, corn and tomatoes. My son calls it yay bean soup. I can eat it for days and not be tired of it.

    Joined the gym last week, met with a trainer tomorrow-- 1 lesson free!

    Parent

    I'm always looking for good soup (none / 0) (#137)
    by caseyOR on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 09:53:36 PM EST
    recipes. Will you share this recipe, Jeff?

    Parent
    For one person: (none / 0) (#143)
    by jeffinalabama on Thu Jul 21, 2011 at 05:38:29 PM EST
    one can tomatoes, one pachage 12-16 oz. lima beans, 1 can, drained, corn. I put salt pork in for flavor, then give the meat to the dogs...

    add water, pepper, and a little bit of salt. Heat to boiling, then simmer until the beans are cooked.

    If you start with dried beans, soak 24 hours prior, and keep adding water as it boils off.

    Parent

    And another thing (5.00 / 2) (#9)
    by StephenAG on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:36:06 PM EST
    Don't feel bad about the pressure. When I had my biopsy done, I screamed louder than Lafayette Reynolds! Do not make any surgery plans until you get the results of your biopsy. When you can, check out my surgeon's site: http://nocancer.com/

    He's the best and has trained and performed all over world. Hope this helps!


    Parent

    Do you still have insurance? (5.00 / 1) (#11)
    by MO Blue on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:40:34 PM EST
    If so, have your doc recommend or refer you to a nutritionist to help you design a diet plan.

    My friend was pre-diatbetic and this was a great help to her. She lost 40 lbs. on a low carb diet in a short period of time and was able to eat quite a bit of food every day. It would also be helpful if you walked every day. It would help with your weight loss and also help control stress.    

    Parent

    We're trying to cram in everything (none / 0) (#35)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:17:15 AM EST
    before it lapses, before I have to make a COBRA payment, since we have no idea what those will be.

    Parent
    Be sure you check with hospital about (5.00 / 1) (#47)
    by MO Blue on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:06:26 AM EST
    requirements for financial relief on bill. Another friend had catastrophic insurance ($10,000 deductible) when she was diagnosed with a treatable but chronic form of cancer. She has some assets like equity in home and retirement account but little income coming in. Bottom line the hospital wrote off everything that she owed. The financial relief was for an entire year. She can also reapply again for another year. She just needs to update the paper work.

    Also, some of the individual cancer organizations often provide financial assistance in the form of grants etc. The hospital where you receive treatment should be able to provide you with all options that are available.    

    Parent

    Forgot to mention that one of the (5.00 / 1) (#48)
    by MO Blue on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:08:21 AM EST
    foundations is also picking up the tab for her insurance premium as well as providing a stipend for her to live on.

    Parent
    Thanks for the advice, (none / 0) (#49)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:16:17 AM EST
    now here's something wonderful for you, MO Blue, Little Jazz, Roy Eldridge, in a midnight jam that somehow got filmed...
    Lester Young, Bennie Golson,Horace Silver... JAzz jam at it's best.

    Parent
    One more (none / 0) (#50)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:19:26 AM EST
    by Little Jazz...Rocking Chair, Studio version.

    Parent
    And a touch of (5.00 / 1) (#51)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:28:54 AM EST
    Roma music...Volare and one of my favorites...
    this one Bamboleo, and when someone messes up, what a dirty look!

    Parent
    Finally, (none / 0) (#52)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:35:37 AM EST
    the queen of Caribbean Music, Celia Cruz. Rie y Llora... espectacular!

    Parent
    Good luck (5.00 / 2) (#78)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:32:36 AM EST
    with everything Jeff. All of us here at TL will be here to cheer you on and encourage you through all your "doctorin'". So on your good days and your bad days you know you can always "talk" to us!

    Parent
    LAUGH!!! (none / 0) (#92)
    by Dadler on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 10:30:26 AM EST
    The cliche is true.  No better medicine.

    Louis CK on getting fat.  (LINK)

    Parent

    That is so my (none / 0) (#138)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 10:19:45 PM EST
    reality... "I've eaten through to the other side!"

    Parent
    Don't know exactly what a real tweet (5.00 / 2) (#27)
    by oculus on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:40:40 PM EST
    would look like, but I enjoyed your description of the dismal surroundings.  Now then, here's a book recommendation (given to me by a nutritionist):  The Calorie King, Calorie, fat & Carbohydrate. Counter.  www.calorieking.com  Turns out one can subsists without orange juice for breakfast (who knew), baked goods, and sweets.  White wine has the least carbs of any alch. beverage.  

    Anyway, you have gone through so much in your life, you are ready to lick this too.    

    Parent

    If you ain't Cav, you ain't ..................... (5.00 / 1) (#113)
    by republicratitarian on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 02:30:01 PM EST


    Parent
    CSM inducted (none / 0) (#117)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 03:36:41 PM EST
    Little Jeffinalabama into The Order of the Golden Spurs last weekend :-)

    Parent
    Score! Very cool. How you feeling? (none / 0) (#118)
    by republicratitarian on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 03:59:23 PM EST


    Parent
    Meh... (none / 0) (#123)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:13:27 PM EST
    hung over might describe it... I tried to drink all of my beer last night/this morning, but had to give away a six pack today. I couldn't force down any more, felt like my belly was a full keg!

    Trying to wrap my head around things.  Also contacting the VA. Still have my insurance through end of August, then COBRA, I hope. Does the government still pick up 66 percent of COBRA, or was that compromised away, also?

    Parent

    I think (none / 0) (#125)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:52:28 PM EST
    that was compromised away. A friend of mine got it but then after six months it was gone.

    Parent
    Great... I'd better start planning (none / 0) (#127)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:56:39 PM EST
    my bankruptcy for medical reasons, then... I hate the idea, have fought tooth and nail to avoid it through difficulties, but... time to make a contingency with the paperwork, if nothing else.

    Parent
    Sorry (none / 0) (#130)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 07:01:20 PM EST
    to be the bearer of such news :(. Sometimes having knowledge about something stinks :(

    Parent
    I'd rather know... (none / 0) (#132)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 07:10:01 PM EST
    Give me the bad news first, not last. Then I can find a way to deal with it.

    Parent
    Jeff are you retired military or did you just (none / 0) (#142)
    by republicratitarian on Thu Jul 21, 2011 at 12:10:33 PM EST
    do your time and move on? I have contacts here in Florida with VA, I wonder if they would be any help.

    Parent
    13 years. Got RIF'ed (none / 0) (#144)
    by jeffinalabama on Thu Jul 21, 2011 at 05:39:29 PM EST
    after the first gulf war.

    Parent
    Sorry to hear that it is cancer. (5.00 / 4) (#7)
    by MO Blue on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:27:44 PM EST
    Hopefully you caught it early on. Great new treatments are being developed all the time. Many of us finish treatment and then go on with life with a better appreciation of what is important.  

    When is the biopsy? Will keep sending you positive thoughts for the best possible outcome of that test.

    Try to focus on the best instead of the worse that can happen while you wait. I know that is not an easy thing to do but will help you cope better until you know a more precise diagnosis.

    Big hugs and warm thoughts going your way.

    Parent

    Doc leaves on a medical mission next week, (5.00 / 2) (#15)
    by jeffinalabama on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:54:39 PM EST
    biopsy Aug 2.

    Diet is supposed to be extremely severe, no carbs. Period.

    I gues my meal swill consist of eggs, grilled chicken, boiled chicken, and pinto beans (peppers of course) without tortillas. Almost enough to put a guy off food.

    Young, surfer-dude doctor. Religious, said "eat God's food. If it's in a can, no."

    But he's supposed to be the best in the UAB area.

    He has some big-assed fingers, though. And semi dreadlocks.

    Parent

    One small thing that may help (5.00 / 3) (#43)
    by gyrfalcon on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:39:51 AM EST
    Well, actually two.  Turn your a/c way up.  There was a study recently that being a little bit chilly burns up a hell of a lot more of the calories that turn into fat.  Don't know if it will bear out, but this seems like a good occasion to give it a try.

    Also, in addition to whatever exercise you do, don't just sit for the rest of the time.  A number of studies have shown that standing burns up vastly more calories than sitting, even if you're not doing anything but standing still.  And those of us who are fidgety (like me!) and can't sit still for very long also burn up more calories.

    Last thought-- there's recent evidence that low or no-calorie sugar substitutes may actually contribute to weight gain.  Something about the way the body immediately starts storing fat just from the taste of sweet.  So stay away from diet sodas and artificial sweeteners in your coffee.  Go cold turkey on sweeteners if you possibly can.

    Thinking of you hard, my friend.

    Parent

    TY. (5.00 / 3) (#46)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:50:56 AM EST
    Got a similar message on the sweeteners. Back to Army coffee for me. Thanks. I'll bump the ac down a little also.

    Parent
    Jeff, if anybody can beat it (5.00 / 3) (#14)
    by jimakaPPJ on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:50:54 PM EST
    That would be you.

    I will be pulling for you.

    Parent

    Brother Jim, (5.00 / 5) (#16)
    by jeffinalabama on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:58:38 PM EST
    SAddam couldn't do it, Ortega couldn't do it, Carlos Escobar couldn't, North Koreans, Haha! the russkies never laid a finger on me, only the panamanian defense force got me across the shin. PRolly a civilian high on cocaine, anyway.

    I will beat this.

    I start pre-Ranger training tomorrow (1975 style). Ought to lose 20 lbs in 3 weeks. Then I'll get serious. MY arteries and veins are all right.

    Parent

    Well, Jeff, not the news (5.00 / 3) (#26)
    by caseyOR on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:39:29 PM EST
    one would have hoped for. Depending on the biopsy results, you may want to get a second opinion. i know it can seem like just too much to do (see yet another doctor, geez!), but you may want a fuller set of treatment options from which to choose.

    No carbs is a drag, but it's summertime. So, eat raw fruits and vegetables, as much as you can. You'll need the nutrients. A big salad with 4-6 ounces of chicken makes an excellent and healthy dinner, especially if you make your own viniagrette instead of buying dressings from the store.

    I have no idea what is involved in pre-Ranger training, circa 1975, but it conjures up visions of physically brutal activities.  I know you need to drop the weight, but you don't want to sprain, strain or break something in the process. :-)

    I am inclined to think this is treatable (maybe because I'm unwilling to think it isn't), so until you tell me something different, I believe you will get through this, and live to dance at Harry's wedding.

    As always, the Pirate Crew stands ready and willing to help in any way.

    All the good thoughts and positive energy I can muster are directed at you, guy.

    Parent

    Pirate Code... (5.00 / 1) (#31)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:09:05 AM EST
    Got to take care of the crew or a parlay for a new captain.

    My vote's for Captain Casey. Quick, fast, and in a hurry.

    Vietnam era Ranger School was the most brutal experience I've ever had. Worse than combat. I'm doing the pre-stuff so my heart doesn't explode!

    Let me tell y'all, there were some tough little monkeys in the Army then, along with a lot of trash.

    I was in the best shape of my life, and I still lost almost a pound a day during Ranger School. That was the worst 56 days of my life. After we got our tabs, and went to mountain or jungle or cold-weather, it didn't matter, and the pressure came off.

    According to the instructors, we went through 56 days of the tension of a 21-day patrol. Since there were no live rounds fired at us, they more than doubled the time. I may have slept 56 hours during those 8 weeks, but it could easily have been less.

    Attrition: 75 to 85 percent. Why? It's something special to be a Ranger.  

    Parent

    Amen Jim... (5.00 / 2) (#85)
    by kdog on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 09:17:01 AM EST
    Bama Jeff v Cancer in a match race?  Cancer is the longshot there, no question.  I don't think you'll find a bookie to give you better than 3-5 on ol' Jeffrey.

    Jeff that fire in your belly is an inferno only you can extinguish, cancer don't stand a snowballs chance.  Your inner strength pours through this electronic interface.  Cancer done f*cked up and messed with the wrong dude...sh*t I pity cancer right now.

    One day at a time, split them logs, feed your fire, beat that sh*t.  Case closed, ya dig?

    Glad thats settled:)

    Parent

    Geez, sounds like (none / 0) (#129)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:59:28 PM EST
    you're describing Jim Brown in the late 60s! or even this year... that is one scary man when he wants to be. thanks, kdog and Jim!

    Parent
    strength & healing, jeff (5.00 / 3) (#20)
    by The Addams Family on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:06:30 PM EST


    Parent
    best wishes, jeff. (5.00 / 1) (#21)
    by observed on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:14:24 PM EST
    I am interested in your history project. Do you see Obama as Johnson redux?

    Parent
    I'm not sure yet... (none / 0) (#29)
    by jeffinalabama on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:53:21 PM EST
    I'm still in the French government, the 4th Republic, where power changed hands frequently-- like the US Congress, anyway, but inertia and poor political leadership there,  12 prime ministers from 48-52... kind of like inertia in congress with minorities controlling majorities... perhaps a major spoiler alert.

    Also, the maintenance and love of plans... without offering modifications... and the reliance on strong fortifications. Movement elements and strike elements, such as the 1er regiment parachutiste etranger got dropped on  specific locations, built fortifications, and dug in deeper.

    Contrast: Baghram, Khe Sanh, An Loc, Hue, Da Nang, and more... including more places in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    Problem? One easy answer. Interference from first PAris and second Washington, without proper support or passing of authority.

    Political Generals: Franks, e.g. For the French? Navarre.

    Worst thing that happened to the French expidition was the death of LeClerc in an aviation accident in Algeria while flying back to France in 1947. He sustained military victories until a High Commissioner, Jean Sainteny, along with LeClerc tried to negotiate with the viet Minh. LeClerc was recalled to Paris, but his plane crashed.

    He was a fighter, a negotiator, and a realist. Navarre? Well, I guess, like Franks, he was a good golfer. Digging, digging, digging.

    Parent

    Admirable your mind keeps working so (none / 0) (#30)
    by oculus on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:08:46 AM EST
    well in such stressful conditions.  

    Parent
    ADHD, lol. (none / 0) (#32)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:10:49 AM EST
    Gotta focus on something.

    Parent
    Yes, but we all know you could be (5.00 / 2) (#33)
    by oculus on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:14:08 AM EST
    wallowing.  But you aren't.  

    Parent
    Yes...for the affirmation of your focus (5.00 / 1) (#110)
    by christinep on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:52:00 PM EST
    and belief.  All these comments from people who care...not simply polite care, but sustained empathy & interest. Yes to life.

    And, here's a second to Dadler's powerful message of LAUGH. Yes, LAUGH!

    Parent

    And it's also the current mission. (none / 0) (#34)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:15:02 AM EST
    I have to be positive, and what I'm finding makes me NEED to write this paper. That a positive attitude helps with both recovery and writing? no problem.

    I wish Cream City was still around to email it to her first. She was a historian, after all. I'm a no name muckety muck sociologist. Yep, in the brutal world of academics, that's a big deal.

    Parent

    Methinks CC is still here. (none / 0) (#36)
    by oculus on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:19:39 AM EST
    I recently read the letters of Bernard de Voto and his biography, both edited by Wallace Stegner.  De Voto constantly wrote to his friends who were academic historians about historical research and writing, of which de Voto did a great deal.  He was famously brash and ostensibly confident, but wanted to make such the academics thought he was on the right track and doing it in the way they approved.  He certainly started by reading every original source obtainable.  

    Parent
    If she hangs around, (5.00 / 1) (#39)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:24:09 AM EST
    I wish she'd send me an email... jeffinalabama  AT google DOT com.

    Brilliance is brilliance. I'm vnturing into her realm, and could use guidance or even  trashing of what I have so far.

    Parent

    Hoping your research and writing will (none / 0) (#40)
    by oculus on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:27:29 AM EST
    resolve to my satisfaction (!) the JFK administrations involvement in early stages of U.S. involvement in Vietnam.  

    Parent
    I hope (5.00 / 1) (#41)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:30:57 AM EST
    along with ya, but I'll be trying to access materiel from too many dead folks, sometimes that's difficult here in the USA.

    However, if I can find appointments and diaries for LeMay, I bet I could get some leads.

    Parent

    Propaganda, but I learned alot here: (none / 0) (#42)
    by oculus on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:36:39 AM EST
    "War Remnants Museum"

    Parent
    ty. (none / 0) (#44)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:45:04 AM EST
    Useful at a minimum for background.

    Here's what I think... had Churchill said, " They will come ashore, we will surrender," that what would have happened.

    From 1947, "Uncle Ho," with the usual, but not perfect, brilliance from General Giap, made the US dance to their tune about 50 percent of the time.

    That's in South Vietnam, not the bombings. The bombings made people angry at the bombers. one dimension, not the only one, and no judgement here on bombing good or bombing bad.

    Bombing cemented resolve against the aggresors.

    Parent

    Now compare to (none / 0) (#45)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:46:46 AM EST
    Afghanistan... the creation of another generation of Taliban? The US has already created another more powerful generation of heroin/opium producers.

    Parent
    The overwhelming responsible (none / 0) (#89)
    by brodie on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 09:54:49 AM EST
    research in the JFK-SEAsia area in the past 15-20 yrs, starting with the landmark John Newman book "JFK and Vietnam" from the early 90s, shows Kennedy acting smartly by the end of his presidency in deciding officially not to send in combat units and also to begin withdrawing (as of the end of that year) and to end all military involvement by the end of 1965.  Even in 1961 the record shows him constantly turning down numerous Pentagon requests to send combat troops to VN.  It's an admin record of continuously saying no to major line-crossing JCS suggestions, while offering them the consolation prize of a few more advisory troops to keep them at least somewhat placated.

    Newman, David Kaiser ("American Tragedy"), Logevall ("Choosing War"), and several other historians have all concluded basically, to varying degrees of certainty, along the lines of what I have stated above.  Of course, I'd be interested in Jeff's research here, too.

    Parent

    I am not a historian. (none / 0) (#58)
    by caseyOR on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 02:58:57 AM EST
    Nonetheless, I look forward to reading your paper.

    Parent
    I learned recently that in the immediate (none / 0) (#57)
    by caseyOR on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 02:57:48 AM EST
    aftermath of the Japanese surrender, the Dutch and the French, with an assist from the U.S., had the Japanese military continue as the official order keepers in Indonesia and Indochina. They were charged with keeping order and crushing any nationalist activity. This went on until the Dutch and the French could muster the troops and get them transported from war torn Europe to their respective colonies.

    Using the cruel and, now resentful of defeat Japanese, in this way did nothing to endear the two imperialist nations to the local population.

    So, in Viet Nam, the French were very persona non grata after WW II. The US., having promised Ho Chi Minh that they would assist his fight after the Japanese were defeated and then having betrayed that because we decided the democratic yearnings of the local people were less important than rebuilding our European allies, lost all credibility with Ho.

    Man, we just never learn, do we? We're a bunch of arrogant bullies.

    Parent

    The OSS made oral agreements to support (none / 0) (#61)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 03:31:21 AM EST
    Ho Chi Minh against the French, but the US Government reneged. Much as  love Truman, this was another of his errors that, in hindsight, really sucks.

    Again, hindsight is 20/20.

    Parent

    Truman's decision to back (none / 0) (#71)
    by caseyOR on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 04:42:56 AM EST
    the European nations as they tried to hang on to their colonies was  huge mistake. I wonder how much the fear of communism had to do with reneging on our agreements to support democracy movements?

    We have a long sad history of choosing autocratic rulers over democracy movements. And that never seems to work out very well in the end. We look like hypocrites. And, well, we are.

    Parent

    Oh, damn...not the news I so wanted you (5.00 / 2) (#83)
    by Anne on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 07:29:04 AM EST
    to get...am sure you're feeling the same way.

    I guess the good news is - there's a plan, there's things to do, there's at least some structure where there was just this big all-consuming fog.

    And you sound so determined to do whatever you have to, whatever you need to, to kick the lights out of this thing.  

    One thing - how many times have you heard that?  Getting a cancer diagnosis is a lot like telling people you're pregnant - everyone has a story, everyone has advice, and sadly - you become the thing you have and not the person you were before, for too many people, and that's a hard thing to cope with.  When my dad was diagnosed, he told me he just hated that people stopped seeing "him" and could only see the disease.  Suddenly, "how are you" was no longer a social convention, and no one was ever satisfied with "fine" - that got a "no, really..how ARE you?"

    I know the disease changes so much, but I promise to do what I can to help you keep being you, if that makes sense.

    One more thing - please check with the VA to see if your Agent Orange exposure would qualify you for (1) free health care and (2) possibly a disability check.  I don't know if your area VA is considered "good," but, shoot, it's a couple of phone calls, so what the heck?

    These are the times when we find out and figure out what we can control and what we can't - and this is one of them.  We're here for you for whatever you need from us.

    Peace.

    Parent

    oh man (5.00 / 1) (#87)
    by CST on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 09:29:49 AM EST
    that's rough.  I'm sure you'll kick it's but in true form though.  We're all rooting for you.

    Parent
    Oh, no (5.00 / 2) (#97)
    by sj on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:26:30 PM EST
    I'm so sorry to hear this.  Just keep doing what you're doing.  It sounds like you're taking Anne's advice and not becoming the illness.

    Good job, that.

    Parent

    Sending an abundance of healing thoughts (5.00 / 2) (#120)
    by byteb on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 04:08:20 PM EST
    and love your way.

    Fight,fight and fight some more (and keep us posted!)

    Parent

    Take care of you (5.00 / 1) (#134)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 08:46:58 PM EST
    My Uncle had to deal with this.  Sending healing thoughts your way.

    Parent
    Thinking of you and hoping the biopsy (none / 0) (#94)
    by vml68 on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 11:59:45 AM EST
    shows that everything is fine.
    BTW, what happened to the Catalan lessons?

    Parent
    R.I.P. Sweet baby girl . . . (5.00 / 5) (#10)
    by nycstray on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:36:16 PM EST
    I lost my dear Dot.tee very suddenly this morning. Still in shock and don't know what to do without her at my side . . . aside from cry that is . . .

    So sorry nycstray (5.00 / 5) (#12)
    by MO Blue on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:45:04 PM EST
    I know how very special Dot.tee was to you and what a fine companion she was.

    Parent
    My deepest (5.00 / 4) (#13)
    by jimakaPPJ on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:47:46 PM EST
    sympathy.

    Dogs are God's gift to man.

    Parent

    NO!!! (5.00 / 4) (#19)
    by The Addams Family on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:05:15 PM EST
    stray, i am so terribly sorry

    remember that the love doesn't die, even though there's a Dot-shaped hole in the world

    Parent

    Aw (5.00 / 4) (#22)
    by lilburro on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:15:20 PM EST
    I am very sorry.  I enjoyed all the comments you shared about her.  

    Tough week for the TL crowd so far :(

    Parent

    Oh, stray, I am so sorry. (5.00 / 5) (#28)
    by caseyOR on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:44:29 PM EST
    I know Dot was very important to you. This is such sad news.

    Parent
    So sorry to read this (5.00 / 4) (#53)
    by Madeline on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:40:03 AM EST
    she was beautiful

    Parent
    So sorry (5.00 / 4) (#79)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:35:05 AM EST
    I love dogs too and when the one I have was sick and I thought he was a goner I told myself no more dogs because it was breaking my heart. Fortunately, he is okay.

    Parent
    Oh, stray, I am so, so, sorry; (5.00 / 5) (#82)
    by Anne on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 07:13:39 AM EST
    I know from your writing just how important Dot was to you - you guys were pretty much joined at the hip, she was so much a part of your life.  

    Oh, you must be just devastated, and it hurts my heart that you are in so much pain.  I know there is consolation all around you - there always is when these terrible things happen - but I'm a firm believer in allowing yourself to grieve as fully as you need to - the consolation, the happy memories, the funny stories - those will all come in due time, as you need them and as you are ready for them.

    For whatever help it is, and for whatever help you need - even just knowing there are a ton of us reading your words and thinking about you - we are here for you.

    Peace to Dot on her last journey.

    Parent

    Sorry stray... (5.00 / 4) (#86)
    by kdog on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 09:23:14 AM EST
    Dot was lucky to have you, our resident Dr. Dolittle.

    If I come back as a dog I wanna be your dog...Dot had a charmed life, no bout a doubt it.  And I'm sure another pooch will at some point too, you're beautiful.


    Parent

    So sorry. (5.00 / 6) (#90)
    by Towanda on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 10:17:16 AM EST
    We're coping with a lot of trips to the vet lately to try to saving the older of our cats -- 17 years old -- and I begin to think that all of these intrusive tests and meds are just avoiding the inevitable.

    And I do not think it fair that animals cannot issue "DNR" orders to not be put through all of this.

    So I read between your lines that your Dot went peacefully?  That is so hard for you but may have been the best thing for her -- and deserved after years of devotion to you.

    Now, frame that photo!  I have a series of such photos of favorite pets of the past, and having each one near me for a while after losing them brought comfort.  So this is a reminder to me to find a photo of our older pet of the present to be ready to do the right thing for him, allowing him to head to that great pet bed in the sky soon.

    Parent

    No, No No and No! (5.00 / 3) (#95)
    by vml68 on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:12:48 PM EST
    I am truly sorry to hear this, Nycstray. Ms Dot may not be with you physically anymore but she will always be in your heart and by your side.  

    Parent
    Oh, honey, I'm so, so sorry (5.00 / 6) (#98)
    by sj on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:26:38 PM EST
    I lost my beautiful boy suddenly last year and I know exactly the shock and overwhelming grief that you're feeling.  The only blessing I could find in that awfulness was that he was himself for his whole life.  One morning he was playing in the snow and suddenly that evening he couldn't even get up to go outside.  From one moment to the next.

    You gave her a good, good life.  As she did for you.  Just know that she stayed as long as she could.

    I'm crying for you, too.  For both of us, I guess.  Or rather, for all of us.

    Parent

    I'm so sorry. Sending love your way. (5.00 / 3) (#119)
    by byteb on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 04:06:05 PM EST


    Parent
    I'm so sorry, nycstray. (5.00 / 3) (#131)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 07:03:15 PM EST
    I can't offer much to assuage your grief, but remember Dot.tee will be waiting at the other side of the rainbow bridge for you, patiently, and will be there when you cross over.

    Parent
    Sincere condolences {{{nycstray}}} (5.00 / 2) (#133)
    by Dr Molly on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 07:36:55 PM EST
    I know how much you loved her and I know you're hurting. But I hope you remember how much love and care you provided, and how good you made things for her.

    Parent
    I am so sorry (5.00 / 1) (#135)
    by Militarytracy on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 08:49:31 PM EST
    It was so easy for me to know what she meant to you just reading your posts.  I know the loss is huge.  I love my family, and love my kids and my grandkids and my husband and still my dogs give me something I cannot find any other place.  

    Parent
    So sorry.... (5.00 / 1) (#139)
    by desertswine on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 10:30:45 PM EST
    you lost a beautiful friend.

    Parent
    I have read more about (5.00 / 2) (#25)
    by observed on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:24:04 PM EST
    Astana. It is in a HUGE boom. The population has tripled in the last 14 years. There are tons of new skyscrapers. I sent an inquiry mostly on a lark, but this job is looking worth taking (if I get the offer). My interviewer is American.

    Anything about opera? (none / 0) (#37)
    by oculus on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:20:43 AM EST


    Parent
    I think i posted this onanother site (5.00 / 1) (#56)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 02:44:20 AM EST
     when my buddy died... I can't do a lot of name dropping but Dan Fogelberg was my friend. Don't know if I was his, but I tried.

    here'sGo Down Easy.

    I knew Dan Fogelberg. (none / 0) (#59)
    by caseyOR on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 03:03:22 AM EST
    He and I grew up in the same town. We were't close. It was more a matter of having mutual friends and acquaintances.

    Parent
    Yet another thing we have in common (5.00 / 1) (#60)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 03:28:00 AM EST
    I didn't grow up with him, be we became friends when I worked in radio in the early 70s. He remembered hos radio friends from then, and we would exchange letters and cards for years afterward. Or maybe his publicist did... I choose to remember the earnest young singer songwriter remembering his roots...

    I remain a romantic, though...

    Parent

    MY favorite from Dan: (none / 0) (#62)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 03:33:09 AM EST
    Old Tennessee

    Parent
    I got a call (5.00 / 1) (#80)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:45:17 AM EST
    from OFA yesterday. They said that I needed to donate to Obama because he needs to get reelected to finish what he started. In my head I'm thinking finish what? Finish his disastrous policies? It would have been better if they had just said "win the future". Good grief. They then asked me if I was going to vote for him in '12 and I said no, I was going to leave the ballot blank and then they said why and I told them because of his record so far. I told them that he is going to have to do a lot better to get me to vote for him. Then they said well I guess this is a redundant question but are you willing to volunteer and I said of course not. I guess my phone number will be crossed off their list.

    don't count on it (5.00 / 1) (#81)
    by desmoinesdem on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 07:13:00 AM EST
    I bet you get five more calls from them in the next year.

    Parent
    Probably (none / 0) (#84)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 08:23:43 AM EST
    but what a waste of time and money for them. First of all, Obama isn't going to carry GA. Secondly, I'm still not going to give him any money. Thirdly, they did call me a bunch of times back in '08 and the person that called couldn't even explain Obama's stances on the issues to me.

    Parent
    For every person like you for whom that call is (5.00 / 1) (#93)
    by AngryBlackGuy on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 11:42:20 AM EST
    a waste, they will find a fellow Georgian like me who will give money and time because we want Obama to win and the GOP to lose.

    At the end of the day, if you hate Obama, hating the GOP more should be motivation.

    I will always maintain that withholding your vote and letting the worse evil prevail is completely illogical, makes absolutely no sense, and those that follow that path are using the logic of two year olds.

    There is no logically supportable argument you can make to defend that position.

    Hate to put that fine a point on it and I mean this as no personal insult but "I am withholding my vote to because Obama hasn't done what I want him to do and if the GOP wins so be it" is just ridiculous in every conceivable way.

    It just is.

    Now everyone is free to take ridiculous positions, but others should be free to call them what they are.  Ridiculous.

    Parent

    maintain what you wish (5.00 / 5) (#99)
    by sj on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:26:44 PM EST
    I maintain that I will not vote against my own interests no matter what initial follows the name.

    Voting against my own interests is an extremely ridiculous position.  So I won't take take it.

    Parent

    Yes (5.00 / 5) (#102)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:43:14 PM EST
    We definitely need more Nixon Goes to China moments, which is what we'll get with your candidate...Republicans would never get away with some of Obama's "accomplishments" like his plan to cut SS, Medicare.  You don't understand these programs because you are privileged and have always been so.

    2% less evil is still evil. If you want to send a message that Obama's doing a great job, well then go for it.

    Don't knock other voters if they don't want to follow in your ridiculous footsteps.

    Parent

    I'm pretty sure that one of the (5.00 / 4) (#103)
    by Anne on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:52:52 PM EST
    reasons the quality of our electoral choices has gotten worse and worse is because people continue to vote using the lowest possible standard: not as bad as the other guy.  So, as long as the other guy - the Republican - keeps getting worse, the Democrat can, too, and, as long as he or she doesn't overtake the Republican in the race to the bottom, the Democrat doesn't have to get better.  I mean, where's the incentive for any candidate to better represent the voters if that candidate knows your vote is his or hers, no matter what?

    Withholding one's vote is not so much about "letting" the worse evil prevail, but about the simple act of saying "no."  The simple act of not giving a bad candidate permission to keep being bad.  The simple act of not continuing to enable a dysfunctional relationship that hurts rather than helps; it's not unlike continuing to enable an addict by paying his or her bills, providing a roof over the addict's head, and finding reason after excuse after justification why one cannot abandon this person - because something terrible might happen.  As if the entire situation isn't already terrible, for both the addict and those who have been enabling the addiction.

    It's a risk, no question, but there comes a time when one has to put the responsibility for the decisions where they belong - on the person - in this case the candidate/incumbent - who has been making them.  

    And yes, sometimes things do get worse before they get better, but as I see it, they're getting worse anyway, aren't they?  Well, you don't think so, but there are a lot of us who do, who see Obama taking us to the same place the GOP wants to go, just a little slower, perhaps.  

    If we keep voting for people who "don't do what we want them to," who's really being ridiculous?  Who's really winning?  Not us, that's for sure.  Meanwhile, these people being elected are set up for life - book deals, speaking engagements, lucrative, comfortable lives with none of the worries that are besetting millions of people in this country, a lot of which are the direct result of policy and legislative decisions these elected people are making.

    This isn't about hate, something you continue to refuse to grasp; but, I guess it makes it easier for you to demonize anyone who dares to question or who has standards higher than "1% less evil."  

    The cycle needs to be broken - not "someday," not "after this election," but now, and the only thing that's "ridiculous" is how many people are willing to keep the status quo going, even though it's not accruing to their benefit.

    Parent

    Your (5.00 / 7) (#109)
    by Ga6thDem on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:37:40 PM EST
    response is silly.

    First of all there aren't going to be a lot of people here in GA donating to Obama simply because the pool of possible donors just isn't that big.

    If I listen to Obama, the GOP is reasonable and are good guys. He's certainly wiling to cut a lot of deals with them. You can't sell the message that they're so bad when you're talking about bipartisanship like Obama is.

    Quit the condescending statements. It's not about "getting everything I want". Ever since I have been posting on this blog I have stated that I have two main issues-healthcare and the economy. Obama has been a failure in both areas.

    I refuse to reward failure with my vote. You can reward it if you want because that's your vote.

    And you never responded to the fact that Obama isn't going to carry GA anyway. The fact is that Obama didn't carry GA in '08 when he had better numbers so he's not going to carry the state in '12 especially with the last reelect number that I saw of 39%.

    Parent

    Voting for a president whose policies (5.00 / 2) (#114)
    by MO Blue on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 02:40:33 PM EST
    will needlessly force you into poverty to finance his corporate tax cuts and further reduce the tax rate for himself and his savvy business friends, is also an act of insanity.

    Parent
    Personally (5.00 / 2) (#100)
    by TeresaInSnow2 on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:40:34 PM EST
    I hope Obama wins so we can have more Nixon Goes to China moments with him... snark.  The idea that he's less damaging than a Republican is ridiculous at this point.  ABG can have him. He doesn't get my vote...

    And I had to vent, but I refused to respond to ABG, which is where I should have responded.


    Parent

    ha! (5.00 / 1) (#101)
    by CST on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:41:07 PM EST
    oh man, Larry Summers is kind of a jerk, but this was funny.

    Talking about his "role" in the movie the social network, and whether the depiction of him was accurate (it was).

    ""One of the things you learn as a college president is that if an undergraduate is wearing a tie and jacket on Thursday afternoon at three o'clock, there are two possibilities. One is that they're looking for a job and have an interview; the other is that they are an a$$hole," he said during an interview at the conference, according to a Fortune transcript. "This was the latter case. Rarely, have I encountered such swagger, and I tried to respond in kind.""

    Obama's Job Creation Program (none / 0) (#1)
    by MO Blue on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:07:26 PM EST
    Obama has recently defended the deals, saying the Korean agreement -- the biggest trade deal since the North American Free Trade Agreement -- will support thousands of U.S. jobs. And it will. But it will also send thousands more U.S. jobs abroad and expand the federal trade deficit, according to a 2007 report by the U.S. International Trade Commission. While Obama has improved those numbers since the report by partially cushioning the blow the deal would deliver to auto workers, the general numbers remain bleak.

    "If you parse Obama's statements very carefully, they only talk about jobs created through exports," said Economist Robert Scott of the Economic Policy Institute, a liberal think tank.

    Scott calculates that the Korea deal will lead to net U.S. job losses of 159,000. "They just ignore imports as though they don't exist," he said of the Obama administration. link
    talk about picking the wrong victim (none / 0) (#4)
    by desmoinesdem on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 10:17:53 PM EST
    Someone in southern Iowa breaks into a farm house Saturday night looking for money, and Congressman Leonard Boswell's at home with his family. I assumed the intruder had no idea the house belonged to a member of Congress, but the suspect has apparently been to the house before, because his mother is friends with Leonard Boswell's wife. Presumably the kid didn't expect the Boswells to be there Saturday night, because they spend most of their time in Washington or Des Moines. Boswell's grandson lives on the farm full-time.

    The man was arrested in Missouri tonight, "charged with first-degree burglary, assault while participating in a felony, going armed with intent and three counts of first-degree robbery."

    Questions for Talk Left readers: is he also likely to face federal charges because he allegedly broke into a member of Congress' house? And if so, how much more prison time is he potentially looking at?

    The weapon he allegedly used was a bb gun. Does that reduce his potential prison sentence, compared to an intruder who uses a real gun?

    You think that's the wrong victim? (5.00 / 2) (#23)
    by Peter G on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:19:50 PM EST
    Try robbing a pregnant woman on the Philadelphia subway!  Would-be thief winds up with broken leg when target gives chase and fights to get her purse and laptop back.

    Parent
    Wow! (5.00 / 1) (#107)
    by Zorba on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:35:25 PM EST
    I'm not sure that it was the wisest thing she could have done (going after a mugger, that is), but OTOH, being pregnant can change your perspective on things.  She must have a kick like a mule, or possibly has taken kick-boxing or karate.

    Parent
    I missed your reply to my request (none / 0) (#96)
    by vml68 on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 12:17:14 PM EST
    on the other thread. I will send an e-mail to J. Thank-you.

    Parent
    Polling on the debt ceiling (none / 0) (#24)
    by lilburro on Tue Jul 19, 2011 at 11:21:35 PM EST
    seems to have gotten a bit better.  I saw the NBC/WSJ polling on the news tonight, and here is some more polling in the right direction.

    But I have two concerns.  Do polls matter to the Tea Party contingent?  And, there's nothing on the table that is really acceptable as a progressive, other than a clean bill.  What's on the table in terms of revenue/cuts is nowhere near acceptable, in terms of the ratio of revenue/cuts.  A clean debt ceiling bill is the answer, and I don't see that the debate has moved in a way that facilitates that.

    For folks that want the 'Old Dead,' (none / 0) (#63)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 03:42:40 AM EST
    Friend of the Devil

    Looks like I'm not (none / 0) (#64)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 03:48:44 AM EST
    sleeping. Oh oh what I want to know, will you come with me

    Here's a particular favorite (none / 0) (#70)
    by caseyOR on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 04:36:10 AM EST
    of mine from the late great Gram Parsons and EmmyLou Harris. I am not the least bit religious, but I find comfort in this song.

    In My Hour of Darkness

    Gram was a brilliant musician. His album Grevious Angel is one I listen to often.

    Parent

    Thank you for the song. (none / 0) (#74)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 05:28:52 AM EST
    Even though he did a lot, I mistook him for Graham Parsons for years. I'm going to find his works now. I will admit to a crush in Emmylou Harris that began about1976 or 1977... but we never met, so I didn't  get a chance to make a fool of myself, lol!

    Parent
    Merle Haggard (none / 0) (#65)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 04:02:20 AM EST
    with Take me back to Tulsa.

    Gotta tell ya, Merle's a mean drunk. Gotta love him, though.

    And a TL type song (none / 0) (#66)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 04:05:48 AM EST
    Momma Tried.

    And another... (none / 0) (#67)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 04:11:05 AM EST
    Branded Man

    Parent
    I've always like (none / 0) (#68)
    by caseyOR on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 04:18:03 AM EST
    Leader of the Band. Dan wrote it after his father died. His dad was a high school band teacher. Back in the late '40s, when my Mom was in nursing school, she needed money, so she sold her trumpet. The guy who bought it was Dan's father.

    Parent
    And this wistful song (none / 0) (#69)
    by caseyOR on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 04:22:21 AM EST
    It always reminds me of going back home to visit my family at Christmas, and running into high school friends with whom I'd lost touch.

    Same Old Lang Syne

    Parent

    Casey, this fits the mood, (none / 0) (#72)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 05:06:03 AM EST
    very different artist though Where Do the Children Play, Cat Stevens. I can't believe he's on a no fly or no entry list here in the land of free expression.

    Parent
    Dan said it was a fairly true story. (none / 0) (#73)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 05:20:20 AM EST
    Not exactly Christmas Eve, and not so sad. They had different lives. The song makes it sound do hard, but he enjoyed and remembered that time. He wrote many sad songs, based on what might have been, but as I knew him, life was forward. He swore he found pictures in a ski shack, though.

    I think he liked to tell stories. I wish I'd known him better. Like I said, he's the only name I can drop, and we weren't that close.

    Parent

    "Leader of the Band" (none / 0) (#91)
    by Towanda on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 10:24:32 AM EST
    brings back memories of how much that song helped one of my brothers after our father died.  Not that my dad was a school band leader, but he always had wanted to be a teacher, as was his dad -- and he was a quiet hero to my band of brothers.

    And the story of the trumpet connection is just great, too!  I hope that helped your mother to make it to her dream, just as that trumpet may have been an instrument, as it were, that helped another aspiring to his dream -- and eventually, inspiring so many through his son's song.

    Parent

    Site Violator perhaps? (none / 0) (#76)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:03:47 AM EST
    Seems completely out of context with the discussion, and I can't recall any punk band named storage london. meh.

    You can't always get what you want, (none / 0) (#77)
    by jeffinalabama on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:31:24 AM EST
    but what you need? You need this

    And here I thought the problem was (none / 0) (#104)
    by Anne on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:06:46 PM EST
    that we needed to create jobs, but the Obama administration apparently thinks it needs to eliminate more of them:  

    The federal government plans to shut 40 percent of its computer centers over the next four years to reduce its hefty technology budget and modernize the way it uses computers to manage data and provide services to citizens.

    Computer centers typically do not employ many people to tend the machines, but analysts estimate that tens of thousands of jobs will most likely be eliminated.

    The federal government is the largest buyer of information technology in the world, spending about $80 billion a year. The Obama administration, in plans detailed Wednesday, is taking aim at some of that by closing 800 of its sprawling collection of 2,000 data centers. The savings, analysts say, will translate into billions of dollars a year and acres of freed-up real estate.

    Does this make sense to anyone?

    That's a harder question (5.00 / 1) (#105)
    by CST on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:18:42 PM EST
    There are certain things we support, because they deserve support.  Social security for example.  I don't care how good or bad the economy is doing, social security is an important program that should always be well funded.  There are a lot of things that fall under that spectrum.

    Something like this...  If the economy were doing well, I'd be all for it, so it's hard to really oppose it on it's merits.

    The better answer would be to replace those jobs with something else.  So if you're asking me if the federal government should be cutting funding in general the answer is no.  But if they spent that $80 billion a year doing something more productive than I could get behind that.  There's got to be a better way to spend $80 billion dollars.

    Or in other words, if they are cutting $1-4 trillion from the budget anyway, they may as well cut things that need cutting, rather than things that need increased funding.

    Parent

    I don't mean to suggest that the (5.00 / 1) (#112)
    by Anne on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 02:13:07 PM EST
    government shouldn't modernize or that it should employ people it doesn't need, but this news seems to be coming with a surprising lack of acknowledgment about what it means to send tens of thousands of people out into an economy where jobs are scarce.

    And I guess the other thing that struck me was, isn't technology one of those areas Obama's always saying we need to educate and train more people for?  

    I think the problem lies in your last paragraph, which seems to pick up on an Obama theme of, "well, as long as we're making painful choices, we might as well make more of them," as if somehow once we inflict this massive dose of pain, things will somehow be better?  That may be a great technique when it comes to Band-aids, but here it just seems to be pinling on, kicking people when they're already down, and it seems truly insensitive and dispassionate.

    I just find that Obama's decisions don't seem to make a lot of sense within a framework that includes real people; I don't ever get a sense of "people have suffered enough - we can't subject them to more of it, so there has to be a better way to get things on track" from him, or from the people at high levels of his administration.

    It's as if we don't really matter when it matters most, when there is more at stake for us - the stakes all seem to be calibrated to what is best for the people and entities that will fund his campaign, as opposed to the vast majority of people who will be affected by his decisions.

    Parent

    I thought Bush made me paranoid (5.00 / 0) (#126)
    by sj on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:56:28 PM EST
    But apparently it was possible to get worse:  my first thought is that the data centers aren't needed anymore because they have much more efficient ways to spy on us.

    Parent
    On a lighter note, Tomassini (none / 0) (#106)
    by oculus on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:19:15 PM EST
    reviews the music/sounds at Yankees game.  The comment re blind person at a different game is really interesting. NYT

    I suppose the music critic gets to put (5.00 / 1) (#108)
    by oculus on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 01:37:13 PM EST
    at least his ticket, parking, hot dog, beer, and peanuts on his expense claim.  

    Parent
    Jay Carney today (none / 0) (#116)
    by lilburro on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 03:27:49 PM EST
    "The president does not support a short-term extension of the debt limit, period," Carney said. "The only exception to that is in the event that both sides reach a deal on a long-term extension of the debt limit plus significant deficit reduction, and we needed a very short-term extension, like a few days, to allow a bit of extra time for a bill to work its way through the legislative process."

    The Hill

    Interesting.  Not sure what "this means."  

    It means (5.00 / 1) (#121)
    by NYShooter on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 04:35:01 PM EST

    The Republicans, having gotten 99% of what they wanted out of Obama, refuse to "compromise" till they get that last 1%.

    Parent

    That would presuppose (5.00 / 1) (#128)
    by sj on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 06:57:30 PM EST
    that the goals of the Republicans and those of Obama were different.

    Parent
    One way they're different (none / 0) (#140)
    by NYShooter on Thu Jul 21, 2011 at 03:04:14 AM EST
    They don't seem to be afraid of women aspiring to/attaining  high office.

    But, regarding reproductive rights, yeah, they're about the same.

    Parent

    That is (none / 0) (#141)
    by lilburro on Thu Jul 21, 2011 at 10:19:55 AM EST
    objectively untrue...

    But, regarding reproductive rights, yeah, they're about the same.


    Parent
    Buy American? (none / 0) (#122)
    by NYShooter on Wed Jul 20, 2011 at 05:16:36 PM EST
    "American" (airlines) said Wednesday it will buy 260 planes from (European) Airbus, and take options to buy hundreds more.
    The contract will run into many billions of dollars, with more billions to follow.

    Now, I'm just pointing this out because of the folly of blaming past Presidents' and the trade agreements they signed. I just don't know how you quell international trade in a modern, Global economy.

    My beef has always been that one of the most important responsibilities a government has is to provide the research and leadership so that its citizens are prepared for whatever the future brings. Instead, it has thrown its lot in with the plutocracy in gouging the world's citizens for short term gains.

    Without focus on research, education, infrastructure, and preparedness to deal in a global, technological environment, the situation we find ourselves in today was inevitable.  

    Tuesday Night Open Thread | 143 comments (143 topical)

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